Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

General Discussion About the 1974 DeFeo Murders and related topics
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bella2005
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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by bella2005 » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:15 pm

astonio wrote:He's SUCH a 14-year old girl.... :roll:

My thoughts exactly!

kathyM
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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by kathyM » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:49 pm

How many copies of part 1 have been sold so far Ryan?

scipio-USMC
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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by scipio-USMC » Fri Mar 16, 2012 8:24 pm

Since Gerri was kind enough to save my messages on Ryan’s page I will explain and prove my points about the weapons.

Here is the CBS overlay

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This the gun they took it from a US Revolver Co (Iver Johnson) Safety Hammer Auto double action

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The US Revolver Company was a cheaper arm of Iver Johnson and this version CBS used was simply the cheap version of their regular Iver Johnson Safety Hammer Auto double action second model . Notice how CBS erased the hammer. This gun is not hammerless it has a hammer the hammer is jsut broken or seared off on the revovler that they found.

The main difference on the exterior of the second and third model of the Iver Johnson Safety Hammer Auto is the number of cross pins. If you look at the pins above the trigger guard the second model has 2 pins (one above the trigger the other above the rear of the trigger guard) while the third model has 3 pins (an extra pin at the front of the trigger guard)

Second Model:

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Third Models:

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The gun that Ryan’s team found looks like it has 3 pins not 2 so CBS messed up. You can also tell this by the handle though. The inside handles of both models are different.

This is the second model with the grips removed:

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Note how the sides inside the handle are rather smooth. The slender piece of metal running inside the handle from the hammer to the bottom of the handle is the mainspring. This kind of mainspring is called a leaf spring.

In contrast the third model uses a coil spring and that is the model that Ryan’s team found. Note how his model has a jagged part flaring out on each side of the handle.

This is the third model with the hammer spring removed so you can see the shape of the handle frame is the same as the gun Ryan found:

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Here is a close up of what the coil spring looks like, note how there is a bar that slides in between the teeth and then the spring is attached to the bar and runs to the hammer:

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Here is a schematic drawing showing the inside of the revolver:

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While there are a variety of top breaks with the same general shape as these Iver Johnson revolvers (H&R, S&W, and Hokins & Allan) none of them have a handle the same as the Iver Johnson Third Model it is unique. The others use leaf springs mainly and the handful that use a coil spring have a much different handle.

Moreover the S&W has a thumb latch hat the gun found lacks

S&W

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The 1880/1890s S&Ws lack this thumb latch but have leaf springs and so do the H&Rs and Hokins & Allan Models.

H&R automatic double action skeleton

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The bottom line is that the gun found is an Iver Johnson Third Model Safety Hammer. They were manufactured 1909-41 and came in two different sizes. The smaller one 4 3/16 long X 3.75” tall and the larger one 5 inches long X 3 7/8” tall. The size difference is too close to be able to figure out from the photo which size the one they found is. The larger frame came in .32 Special and .38 S&W while the smaller frame came in .32 S&W and .22 rimfire.

All of the guns that have this same general shape came in these varieties not merely the Iver Johnson so the 38 S&W is the most powerful round that the gun he found could have fired even if I were wrong about it being an Iver Johnson but look at the photos and judge for yourself. The teeth for the coil hammer spring is very distinctive.

A rifle has greater range and power than a handgun for 3 reasons. 1) A rifle can take a larger cartridge. The larger the cartridge the more propellant it can hold which means in general that it can propel a round faster and further than a cartridge with less propellant, how heavy the round is and its aerodynamics will play a role as well but the size of the charge is quite important. 2) A rifle bullet is larger thus makes a bigger hole and does more damage because it can damage a larger area. The caliber is merely the diameter of a round. Thus even though a pistol round may be a hair fatter in some instances they are still shorter than a rifle round. 3) The longer the barrel the greater the velocity.

Thus a long barrel, more propellant and bigger bullet means much more power and damage than a handgun round. The damage done by the bullets in question was massive that is why it took only one bullet to kill each sibling. They were designed to take down deer and other small game. The 38 S&W is a weak round. It has much less powder than and much less velocity. A fatter round is less aerodynamic there is more friction that helps slow the round down anyway add to that the much less charge and smaller barrel compared to a rifle and there is no comparison. Anyone who thinks a 38 S&W would shatter the ribs and continue right through the body and through the bed into the box spring just like the undisputed rifle rounds has no understanding of ballistics at all.

This is a matter of physics and other sciences.

If Ryan would talk to an expert they would confirm that a 38 S&W isn’t going to be mistaken for a 35 rifle round and isn’t going to cause the damage that item 33 did to Louise.

Add to that how close the entrance and exit wounds are and the similar path both bullets took it is rather apparent that someone standing in the same spot fired both rounds in quick succession. Louise was staring to get up and leaned over on one side if time passed she would not have been in that same exact position for the second bullet.

Louise's wounds

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The last thing is look at the small holster that the Iver Johson fits in, it is nothing at all like the holster found in the sewer it would flop around in the holster discovered in the sewer:


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Dan the Damned
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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by Dan the Damned » Fri Mar 16, 2012 10:55 pm

Excellent post!!!

ImageImageImageImage

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sherbetbizarre
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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by sherbetbizarre » Sat Mar 17, 2012 5:01 am

scipio-USMC wrote:The bottom line is that the gun found is an Iver Johnson Third Model Safety Hammer. They were manufactured 1909-41 and came in two different sizes. The smaller one 4 3/16 long X 3.75” tall and the larger one 5 inches long X 3 7/8” tall. The size difference is too close to be able to figure out from the photo which size the one they found is. The larger frame came in .32 Special and .38 S&W while the smaller frame came in .32 S&W and .22 rimfire.

Anyone who thinks a 38 S&W would shatter the ribs and continue right through the body and through the bed into the box spring just like the undisputed rifle rounds has no understanding of ballistics at all.

This is a matter of physics and other sciences.
Sums it up nicely... Katco have an "expert" in most area's of Shattered Hopes, surely they'll need a gun expert for Part 3... Let's hope he's as thorough as you.


And talk about burying his head in the sand - here Ryan reduces Scipio's points to the work of a troublesome rival forum member -
Roxanne Salch Kaplan
And he was actually from the "truth" forum?!

SHATTERED HOPES: THE TRUE STORY OF THE AMITYVILLE MURDERS
Yeah....*rolls eyes*...Apparently when I don't read their forum or pay attention to the petulant behavior, they feel the need to come over here with their smelly diapers to drone on endlessly with their oh-so-stunning (ill-informed) insights. I guess it's to be expected when you deal with children.
:fp:

kathyM
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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by kathyM » Sat Mar 17, 2012 7:17 am

I find it silly that Ryan wont let his peeps see anything Scipio posted. After all, we listened to Whisper babble for weeks and didnt stop her and she is still even welcome here. Why not allow any discussion between them? Ryan must not have much faith that his followers will still follow him if he has to control everything that is being posted. Scipio was not disrespectful yet Ryan deletes all the posts and then makes out Scipio to be some kind of crazy member of this board.

First of all, Scipio hasnt even been here but a few weeks so he has no loyality to this board to defend over at Ryan's page. Scipio is just a person with some very good points and questions that Ryan wont or cant seem to answer.

How many dvds have you sold so far?

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TigresMeow
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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by TigresMeow » Sat Mar 17, 2012 7:51 am

Ryan accuses us of acting like children who need attention???? Is he serious???? He is the one that deleted Scipio's post because he cannot or will not debate this yet we are the immature ones?? Maybe Ryan should check his own diaper before he flings poo at others.

I am laughing so hard at that I am in tears. Real mature statement there, Ryan.

:D :D :D :D :D
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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by scipio-USMC » Sat Mar 17, 2012 10:22 am

kathyM wrote:I find it silly that Ryan wont let his peeps see anything Scipio posted. After all, we listened to Whisper babble for weeks and didnt stop her and she is still even welcome here. Why not allow any discussion between them? Ryan must not have much faith that his followers will still follow him if he has to control everything that is being posted. Scipio was not disrespectful yet Ryan deletes all the posts and then makes out Scipio to be some kind of crazy member of this board.

First of all, Scipio hasnt even been here but a few weeks so he has no loyality to this board to defend over at Ryan's page. Scipio is just a person with some very good points and questions that Ryan wont or cant seem to answer.

How many dvds have you sold so far?
Actually the whole "feud" with this site makes him look even more childish and ridiculous.

This site is dedicated to discussing facts about the case. If people who discuss facts are rivals than tha treveals he has no interest in the facts at all.

Based on what I have read and other have copies I see he used to post here under his own name. Apparently he stopped because he got his head handed to him.

So now any person who finds this site and dares to post questions or facts about the case is labeled a truther who refuses to buy his revisionist trash.

The fact he is not stopped from posting here and his posts won't be deleted yet he needs to send "spies" is hilarious. The man is an insecure clown who would be trounced in any debate on this subject. That is why he avoids a debate and just hides in controlled settings where he can erase any serious questions aked and erase any posts that refute his claims.

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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by kathyM » Sat Mar 17, 2012 12:56 pm

:clap:

I am glad that nobody outside of Ryan's facebook page take him seriously or even know about his fakeumentary. And no, CBS only reported the story because of the popularity of the Amityville haunting story, not because they take the whole gun thing seriously especially since they reported the Suffolk County Police Department doesnt take it seriously.

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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by scipio-USMC » Thu Apr 05, 2012 1:46 pm

kathyM wrote::clap:

I am glad that nobody outside of Ryan's facebook page take him seriously or even know about his fakeumentary. And no, CBS only reported the story because of the popularity of the Amityville haunting story, not because they take the whole gun thing seriously especially since they reported the Suffolk County Police Department doesnt take it seriously.
Note how he still refuses to address my points and has not addressed the William Davidge issue either. If I were in his place and it were shown that Billy was still in AMityville and graduated there as opposed to being in Florida like he claimed I would sure want to address it.

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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by kathyM » Thu Apr 05, 2012 2:35 pm

My guess is that he wont address your questions because he can see he screwed up and is busted but wont admit it.
His documentary is a mockumentary.

He likes to throw the word factual around a lot yet doesnt even get the facts straight! And why in the world would he keep touting his documentary to be factual? Wouldnt people think it would be factual? (even though his isnt). Who would make a documentary that wasnt factual? That is as bad as the whole three part trilogy statement! :lol:

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Shawn
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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by Shawn » Thu Apr 05, 2012 2:46 pm

TigresMeow wrote:Ryan accuses us of acting like children who need attention???? Is he serious???? He is the one that deleted Scipio's post because he cannot or will not debate this yet we are the immature ones?? Maybe Ryan should check his own diaper before he flings poo at others.

I am laughing so hard at that I am in tears. Real mature statement there, Ryan.

:D :D :D :D :D
He's such a hypocritical bastard. He banned me from his board because I said here that he was acting like a child, which he was and still is. Before he banned me I never said one bad thing against him other than commenting on his childish behavior. Personally, after seeing his antics for these past few months my opinion of Ryan is that he is one major douchebag. :roll: Would that make his minions douchettes? :think:
Any and all comments made by the poster "Shawn" are purely his opinion and do not reflect the opinions of the board owners, administrators or moderators. Also, all postings done by the member "Shawn" are property of "Shawn" and cannot be reproduced in any way shape or form without written permission from the poster known here(@http://www.amityvillefaq.com) as "Shawn". TIA.

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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by Forsberg21 » Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:23 pm

It will take you 5 hours to address my points? Then you are in big trouble because part 3 is shorter than that.
:clap: :clap: :clap:
I can just file a FOIL request and get these document anyway if you actually sent them something my request might reveal you didn't.
:clap: :clap: :clap: ^infinity! I bet Ryan nearly had a heartattack when he read that! LOL^infinity!

Thank you for the detailed firearms ballistics message with photographs, your forensic-based expositionary content is priceless.

The director of that documentary and his group of people are hostage to their own deeds and they know it.

scipio-USMC
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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by scipio-USMC » Thu Apr 26, 2012 1:27 am

This shows a perfect example of how Katzenbach distorts:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbABnP3Wp4U

The Nonnewitzes say they never met Gerladine until 1985 so this claimed event must have occurred 1985 or later. Thus it can't prove that Gerladine was around at the time of the trial and appeals which is what Weber denies.

Two he says he visited Webers office and they got nothing. He did not say they met Weber he said they went to his office. Even if true he could have not been there or could have bene there and told his assistants to kick them out.

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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by FoxyJ » Thu Apr 26, 2012 9:29 am

Thanks again Scipio for another well researched and informative post. I found the illustrations/descriptions interesting even though I know that only RJD's Marlin was fired in the house that night - there is absolutely zero evidence of another weapon having been used to murder the DeFeo family. I dare say that if they pulled out the plug from the Amityville river they would find a squillion different types of rusting weapons, plus the obligatory teaspoon!

My feeling has always been that Messrs. K and O know full well, and have done for some time, that they have been 'had' by, in the first instance Ron and latterly Mrs. G; they have a considerable amount of egg-on-face but embarrassment precludes their admitting their mistake and they stand to lose financially should they recant at this (too) late stage; they're between a rock and a hard place; they have only themselves to blame. The amount of insult-hurling and banning coming from the SH Pages simply confirms my opinion. However, knowing they've been right royally duped and yet to continue to defame the memories of innocent people is thoroughly shameful.

Fox
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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by scipio-USMC » Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:17 am

FoxyJ wrote:Thanks again Scipio for another well researched and informative post. I found the illustrations/descriptions interesting even though I know that only RJD's Marlin was fired in the house that night - there is absolutely zero evidence of another weapon having been used to murder the DeFeo family. I dare say that if they pulled out the plug from the Amityville river they would find a squillion different types of rusting weapons, plus the obligatory teaspoon!

My feeling has always been that Messrs. K and O know full well, and have done for some time, that they have been 'had' by, in the first instance Ron and latterly Mrs. G; they have a considerable amount of egg-on-face but embarrassment precludes their admitting their mistake and they stand to lose financially should they recant at this (too) late stage; they're between a rock and a hard place; they have only themselves to blame. The amount of insult-hurling and banning coming from the SH Pages simply confirms my opinion. However, knowing they've been right royally duped and yet to continue to defame the memories of innocent people is thoroughly shameful.

Fox
Ryan and Ric have not been had but rather knew that Geraldine was a fraud all along and that her tales can't be true. Osuna knowingly relied upon recanted affidavits without mentioning the fact the affiants recanted. He demonstrated he was familiar with the 440 motion ruling that discussed the very issue of testimony on the issue. He intentionally chose to rely on recanted claims and statements including the story he claims Ron told him which was either recanted or made up. Osuna visited Ron once- he can't have relayed all the details in the book in that single visit thus even if Ron did tell him something most of the book still had to have been made up by Geraldine.

Without Geraldine Osuna and Katzenbach have no story so that is why they have to lie to validate her and ignore all the evidence she is a fraud. The whole tale allegedly told by Ron is self-serving and makes no sense at all. Just read my thread about the alibis. It shows just how this crap is being made up after the fact and makes no sense at all. Osuna and Katzenbach are as lacking in candor as Geraldine- birds of a feather...

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FoxyJ
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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by FoxyJ » Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:23 am

You're right of course Scipio - I have a tendency to be over-generous. I have read every word you've written here. :)

I did, however, spend twenty quid for Mr. O's penny-dreadful so have only myself to blame for getting carried away! :roll:

Fox :)
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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by scipio-USMC » Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:57 am

FoxyJ wrote:You're right of course Scipio - I have a tendency to be over-generous. I have read every word you've written here. :)

I did, however, spend twenty quid for Mr. O's penny-dreadful so have only myself to blame for getting carried away! :roll:

Fox :)
At first I gave them the benefit of the doubt but the more I learned about the facts and the more I saw them in action the more it was apparent they were not "innocent Madoff victims" but rather were people knowingly peddling "Madoff's ponzi scheme" for a cut of the proceeds.

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Re: Shattered Hopes producer Ryan Katzenbach is a coward

Post by scipio-USMC » Wed Nov 05, 2014 9:35 am

bump

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