The sewing room

General Discussion About the 1974 DeFeo Murders and related topics
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VampireKen
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The sewing room

Post by VampireKen » Mon Apr 13, 2009 10:04 am

Ok this I believe is another Amityville Mystery. Why when the Lutz family moved in the sewing room was a problem but not with the Defeos? and was it actually a extra room?
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dnddad324
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Post by dnddad324 » Mon Apr 13, 2009 3:42 pm

The sewing room was Marc and John DeFeo's former bedroom.
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VampireKen
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Post by VampireKen » Tue Apr 14, 2009 8:55 am

dnddad324 wrote:The sewing room was Marc and John DeFeo's former bedroom.
Yeah. but did anything strange ever happen when they were there?
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Dan the Damned
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Post by Dan the Damned » Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:54 am

That's up for speculation.

Ronnie claims nothing supernatural happened to him or his family. Of course, during an interview with Hans Holzer, Ronnie said quite the opposite -- but I think we can let this go. At the time, Holzer was brought in by Weber and was writing a book about the case. I think its safe to say that Weber was promising money to Ronnie, and it would be in his best interests to tell Holzer what he wanted to hear.

There have been stories of the DeFeos experiencing paranormal activity in that house, but I'm not sure how well this is all substantiated. Some of that comes from the Warrens, so bad luck there... :roll:

Some say the reason they had all that religious statuary in the yard was due to weird stuff happening.

In short, we really don't know if the DeFeos had any paranormal experiences there or not. Seems doubtful to me, but I don't know...

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Howard64
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Post by Howard64 » Tue Apr 14, 2009 1:38 pm

i find it interesting that out of the blue...Ron Sr. puts religious statuary in the front yard. (at least i assume im correct in this)

If there was nothing going on, why the sudden change...im just curious.
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Post by Chichibcc » Tue Apr 14, 2009 4:13 pm

Howard64 wrote:i find it interesting that out of the blue...Ron Sr. puts religious statuary in the front yard. (at least i assume im correct in this)

If there was nothing going on, why the sudden change...im just curious.
Good question...I don't think he was always considered to be the "religious" type.

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Howard64
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Post by Howard64 » Tue Apr 14, 2009 5:16 pm

well thing is...theres no one to tell us for sure...so...another mystery..
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Dan the Damned
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Post by Dan the Damned » Tue Apr 14, 2009 10:43 pm

chichibcc wrote:I don't think he was always considered to be the "religious" type.
He sent his kids to a private Catholic school...

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Howard64
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Post by Howard64 » Wed Apr 15, 2009 5:13 am

well Dan, when i was growing up i was sent to church all the time...alone a lot too. I don't feel that makes a person religious just because they send their kids off to church while the parents have a nice quiet Sunday sipping a cold drink and enjoying the peace and quiet.

I just get the feeling that perhaps Mr Defeo fund out something wasn't right and tried a last minute fix.
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Post by SwingMan » Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:50 am

Howard64 wrote:well Dan, when i was growing up i was sent to church all the time...alone a lot too. I don't feel that makes a person religious just because they send their kids off to church while the parents have a nice quiet Sunday sipping a cold drink and enjoying the peace and quiet.

I just get the feeling that perhaps Mr Defeo fund out something wasn't right and tried a last minute fix.
The impression I got was - seeing how the statuary appeared not long afterwards - that Ronald Sr. had a real "Come to Jesus" moment after his life was spared thanks to the gun Ronnie held to his head misfiring.

Whether Sr. was counting his blessings or he thought 'the devil' tricked Jr. into using the gun that day, I obviously don't know - but I believe that event was the catalyst behind the statuary.
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Post by Dan the Damned » Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:56 am

I think such a life-saving event might be strong enough to make a person turn to religion -- the whole "its a miracle my life was spared" sort of thing.

I just find that story hard to believe (about Ronnie breaking up a fight between Dawn and his dad by pointing a rifle at his head and pulling the trigger).
  • --It sounds like Ronnie boasting

    --No one else has heard this story from another family member (who apparently were all witnesses), only from Ronnie -- surely the kids would mention it to their schoolfriends

    --There is a similar story of Ronnie doing the exact same thing, but not to his father, to a friend of his -- too coincidental to happen twice -- I think Ronnie heard a similar story somewhere and thought it sounded cool

    --I don't think Ronnie would have been allowed to stay at the house afterwards

    --I don't think Ronnie would have been allowed to keep his guns afterwards

    --I think Ronald Sr would have called the cops and had Ronnie thrown into jail, especially when this came after his theft of the outboard motor and the later payroll heist
But who knows. Maybe that incident did happen, and maybe that's what caused the statuary to go up. But again, if they were experiencing strange things, wouldn't they tell any of their friends and family, like the Lutzes did? Wouldn't the kids, at least, tell their school mates?

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Post by Chichibcc » Wed Apr 15, 2009 5:20 pm

Dan the Damned wrote:
chichibcc wrote:I don't think he was always considered to be the "religious" type.
He sent his kids to a private Catholic school...
A private Catholic school? Oh, that's right...

Well, he was probably one of those people who practiced religion in a more private manner, I suppose.
Last edited by Chichibcc on Wed Apr 15, 2009 5:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Dan the Damned » Wed Apr 15, 2009 5:23 pm

Perhaps, but do we have any evidence that he was not a particularly religious man?

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Post by Chichibcc » Wed Apr 15, 2009 5:27 pm

No, not really...but then again, there's so much we don't know...

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Post by blueroc85 » Fri Apr 17, 2009 1:28 pm

I agree....there is so much we don't know regarding the DeFeos and what their life was really like at 112. There are no credible people get the answeres from. This leaves so much room for speculation and it is one of those aspects of the case that will forever remain a mystery.
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Post by VampireKen » Mon Apr 20, 2009 2:15 pm

blueroc85 wrote:I agree....there is so much we don't know regarding the DeFeos and what their life was really like at 112. There are no credible people get the answeres from. This leaves so much room for speculation and it is one of those aspects of the case that will forever remain a mystery.
thats true. the November 15th issue of the New York Times said the family was "A Nice Normal Family". They cared for each other and Mr. Defeo was a very nice man. That is actually in the article. Nobody knew what was really happening in that house.
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Post by Brendan72 » Fri Apr 24, 2009 6:03 am

Since when has the media reported anything accurate? Besides, I think even the media might sometimes take the quotation of a person who knew the family to paint them as the victim rather than as a dysfunctional family.

Also, if this information was not public knowledge at the time (November 15th) then it would come out much later in the trial when details of the alleged abuse were revealed. That doesn't make Senior necessarily an abusive parent - he was probably at his wits end with his troublesome eldest son over the faked robbery ... the incident in the basement where they had the physical altercation was probably an end result of that ... the murders were the final result, more than likely.

I strongly feel money was one of the motives - to a person hooked on drugs and with a history of violence (whether drug-induced psychosis or otherwise) this would be like taking away their life's blood, or a vital function towards their survival. Desperate times called for desperate measures, including murder.

DeFeo Jr admitted that "once it started I just couldn't stop" .. I think his initial intention was to shoot his father and it escalated from there. I think he feels guilty for the deaths of his siblings and is carrying that guilt.
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Shawn
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Post by Shawn » Fri Apr 24, 2009 11:15 am

Wasn't it quoted from ronald SR. that he stated (or something like this) "I got a devil on my back"???

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Post by VampireKen » Fri Apr 24, 2009 12:05 pm

Yes, Ed Warren said on the history's mysterys show that when a neighbor asked Mr.Defeo about the shrines around the house he said he had a devil on his back. It is debated about what he meant though. He called Ronnie a devil once. Some believe he was refering to Ronnie.
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Shawn
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Post by Shawn » Fri Apr 24, 2009 2:17 pm

ah...Ed Warren said it.


In my best Emily Litela voice........"Never mind" !! :)

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Dan the Damned
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Post by Dan the Damned » Fri Apr 24, 2009 5:34 pm

It was mentioned also during the trial by Burt Borkan. Here are some excerpts.

from "High Hopes":
To this day, I do not know how Burt Borkan, the mystery witness, was connected to the Steinguy investigation. Borkan was a New York City patrolman who ran a used-car business on the side. A twenty two year police veteran, he was assigned to the department's community affairs division. For several yers until 1974, when he was defeated for reelection, he had served as financial secretary for Brooklyn South's Police Benevolent Association. Brigante-Karl Buick serviced cars for PBA members, and Borkan had bought several autos from the agency. He was a close friend of the DeFeo family. He had known Ronald DeFeo Sr., for more than sixteen years, and he was Allison's godfather. And the Friday before the murders, he had heard Butch DeFeo threaten to kill his father.

Borkan had tears in his eyes when he described his friendship with Ronald DeFeo Sr. But he made no secret of his disdain for Ronald Jr. He said he had acted as an intermediary to persuade Butch to cooperate with police in the robbery investigation. Since he knew the family, detectives on the case had asked him to get Butch down to headquarters to make a statement and pick out mug shots. Apparently, that attempt failed and police had to call Ronald Sr., and tell him that his son was not cooperating. On the Friday before the murders, Borkan went to the Brigante-Karl Agency to pick up his own car, in which an oil pump was being replaced. This was between 5p.m. and 5:30 p.m. The DeFeos were about twenty five feet away from him, near the polish line – the father and son facing each other. Ronald Sr. was saying that he had the devil on his back and he had to get rid of the devil. Butch DeFeo glared at his father. "You fat prick," Borkan recalled him answering. "I'll kill you." Then he ran into his car and drove away. Ronald Sr. remained standing in the same spot.
Later on in the book, it is unclear whether the following is a quote from Louis Falini, or whether it is Sullivan reminding us of what Borkan said earlier.

from "High Hopes":
Louis Falini had something in common with George Glaubman and Anna Johnson. He was a court buff. He had been following the trial, and he wanted to advise me on questioning witnesses. Apparently, he took it for granted that we had the right man. If I followed his advice, a conviction was in the bag. For an hour, I nodded and said yes. Then we got around to the DeFeos.

I didn't get much. If he knew any secrets, Louis Falini was not about to give them away to a nice Irish prosecutor from Suffolk County. Falini said he had been close to the DeFeos, but the relationship had eroded in later years. He felt terrible about the tragedy. Ronnie Sr., had been a wonderful father who loved his family, and Falini had never heard of him being involved in anything illegal. As to why Butch had tried to put the blame on him, Falini couldn't imagine. But he knew the kid was trouble. Ronnie Sr., had referred to Butch as the devil. "I have the devil on my back," Ronnie Sr. would say.
And lastly, here are a couple of snips from an interview between Hans Holzer and Ronnie.

from "Murder in Amityville":
Q: Did your family members report anything unusual to you in that way?

A: They were always saying somebody is in the house; ghosts, all that.

Q: Did any of them ever see any?

A: I recall my mother or somebody at one time said they saw something. But what it was, I never got into with them.

Q: She said she saw a ghost?

A: Not a ghost.

Q: An apparition?

A: They felt the devil was in the house, to be honest with you. That's what brought all the religion into the house.
from "Murder in Amityville":
Q: Your father had said "I have a devil on my back," What do you think he meant by that?

A: Me.

Q: You were the devil?

A: Yeah. That's what he said.

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